The Curt Flood Compromise?

[retep]

People who label Homeruns as un-patriotic or whatever should read no further. Go practice bunts or something.

OK, I am beginning to agree that we can handle Curt Flood to host even more of our games. I do like the larger field while playing defense (including the large infield throws.). But the is one problem:

NO HOMERUNS?!?!!

Ok, so there is the occasional inside the park HR. And Will and Ahmer have hit it out to right, and Carlos could too. But basically, the place is the anti-Coors field. Both Paul and I have hit balls maybe as hard as we can, and they haven’t gotten out. Nick hasn’t hit one out.

OK, I understand that this maybe shows that we’re not that great of hitters. Ok, fine. We never thought so, I'd hope (that goes for non-HR hitters as well). But Homeruns should be part of the game. Ty Cobb hated HRs but he still has a bunch.

Besides the HR totals, there I another problem to this: as an outfielder, it’s a ridiculous amount of space to cover. Its not that bad down the lines, but it’s soooo hard to cover the gaps. For example, most MLB fields have one deep area. At SBC, its hella deep to Right-Center. Astros, very deep to center. But it is very rare to find a park with two very deep fields. The reasons is that the outfields need to be able to cover all areas.

The result is exactly what we wanted to avoid by moving to Curt Flood: cheep hits. The field requires outfields to choose between guarding the lines or guarding the gaps, and either decision has major consequences. It makes it easy to dump a 2B down the line, or a simple fly ball to the gap is trouble.

Now for my idea:

I saw we set our own boundary for an outfield “wall.” We should set it closer… not DeFremery close, but close enough to where one-four balls could be hit over it. How we set rules as to how honest we’d be about it, if fielders could cross it, and whatever could be worked out.

If we did this, I wouldn’t mind moving even more (all? 75%?) of our games to Curt Flood.

This is not as stupid as it sounds. You know those sport fields with like 4 baseball diamonds on it whose outfields cross over each other? Its very common to paint a “wall.”

I wanna hear what people think. But could we pass on the “homeruns are stupid” arguments? This is an idea used by several park and rec departments in the Bay Area.

[tallguy]

For a start perhaps we could rule the dirt infield of the softball field as being "beyond the wall". If the ball gets there without bouncing, HR!

I want to applaud Will for using wood against his preference. The fact that he hit multiple HR with wood should encourage him to keep doing so. This is especially important at Curt Flood, since the RF fence is so much closer than the LF fence, unlike Defremery where it's about the same. Now we just need Carlos to switch, too...

[retep]

I'm gonna assume you support the idea, Paul?

[tallguy]

Totally. The lefties have too big and advantage at Curt Flood, this would give us righties a chance for some HR there.

[Baseball=Life]

Hey you guys probably know I love homeruns. But I'm not sure how you would create a marker to indicate a HR. Are you talking about laying down a chalk line? To do so, you're looking at about $150 in expenses. Or are you talking about just using the dirt from the softball field? I don't like that answer because that only effects RF, and not CF or LF. And, as agreed on by all, RF is already hitter-friendly at Curt Flood... we don't need to make it any easier.


So it seems like the only answer to "bring in the fences" would be to invest in the chalk line equipment.

And even if we did that, we'd have to rely on the outfielder (in most cases) to tell us whether the ball landed past the line or not..... that's less than ideal to have the defending outfielder make the call on a HR.

More details on this idea, please.

[AntMoOAK]

I have to give this a thumbs down. It just isn't natural to me. There's nothing like a ball sailing over a fence. Homeruns will come. As it warms up in the late summer early fall, the ball will carry better. The homerun hitters will start getting their homeruns to left and left center soon. Paul has hit fungoes to very deep center during practice which would have been over the fence in L or LC. Also at what height would you judge the "homer". I hit primarily line drives (when I hit ) and have made near the left field fence on a low liner. If it goes past the "line" at 6 ft off the ground, is that a homer. I say we find a field in between DeFremery and Flood ( they are out there). Just my thoughts on the subject.

[Baseball=Life]

I doubt more adequate fields are out there, per my search a few months ago. The only field that comes to mind that might be better is McConnell in Oakland. (Can't remember the address, need to look it up). This field has a fence in left, and in right, but not in center. So it would fix the HR situation at Curt Flood. The danger on this field is that we'd lose foul balls that were hit on the 3rd base side (you know, like those hits at DeFremery that go into or clear the trees adjacent to the left field foul line).

I was talking about McConnell earlier today with Ken because we need to have a non-DeFremery backup field for this Sunday, in case those cheerleader tryouts are going on again (they shouldn't be per the discussion I had with the organizers, but you never know).

We should have a game sometime at McConnell anyways, just to test it out and see if we like it. The more options we have the better.

So, I'll find the McConnell address, and perhaps even go re-inspect it. At the least I'll dig up my notes on it and re-post the details. I have a feeling it's not that far from Curt Flood also.

Oh, I think Anthony has made valid points about the line drives that would qualify as HRs under the chalk line system, which in fact would normally be hit off the wall. So we need to think further if we're going to somehow adjust Curt Flood. And I hope he is right about the weather changes leading to some HRs to LF and CF at Curt Flood, maybe they will.

Finally, because I know you're probably thinking about Franklin, Anthony, we need to rule this place out once and for all. I'm convinced that A) you cannot access the field on Sundays; and B) CF is too short becuase of the way the field juts in at CF.... in other words it looks like a bite was taken out of the normal sized field, right where CF would be. So your thoughts on this would be appreciated.

[AntMoOAK]

Hey Scott,

You asked for my thoughts on Franklin so here goes. The field is accesible all the time. Has been since forever. The only people that use the field are soccer players sometimes although they mostly play at San Antonio Park down the street. Sometimes the Little League T-shirt leagues play here but mostly on Saturday mornings. As far as the dimensions, they were measured using Google Earth's measuring tool which is pretty accurate. I used known measured fields such as football fields and the Coliseum as controls. The dimensions were:

L: 265
LC: 275
C: 225 with a 30 foot fence
RC: 225
R: 235

Give +/- about 3-4 feet.

Let me explain the quirks of this field. Center doesn't actually jut out. It's more like LF is set back a little further than the rest of the outfield. Although 225 to center may seem silly, there is a 30ft fence all around the outfield. Meaning to hit one out of CF may seem enticing, but you have to hit a towering fly ball to straight away center to clear that fence and it's not as easy as it may seem. RF may seem like it would be too easy for the likes of Will and Carlos, but the fence at Franklin in R is twice the height than at DeFremery. To sum it up, Franklin is a little bigger than DeFremery but with a fence just as tall in the outfield to hold back rampant homeruns.

McConnell is at Arroyo Viejo park in East Oakland (80th and Olive) although the address is listed as 7701 Krause. This is the GHETTO. I would not feel comfortable as an Oakland native playing here... let alone people like Pat and Paul driving nice luxury cars in this area. Besides the dimensions of this field are even bigger than that of Curt Flood. It is where Castlemont H.S. plays their home games- but again it is not ideal. I encourage you to go to take a look at Franklin. Walk around it an get a feel for it. The main gate to the field is right on the corner of 11th Ave. and Foothill Blvd. There is another gate on the corner of 10th Ave and E. 15th St. ( the streeet that runs parallel to the west) If the gate on 10th and E.15th is not open, the only barrier is a 3ft tall gate that you hop over that leads you to the asphalt playground. continue to the field and the gate to the field is in cener. But again the main gate is on 11th and Foothill.

[retep]

I LIKE THE SOUND OF THAT PLACE!!!

Scott, I was thinking spray paint. That's what I have seen little leaugers use.

[Baseball=Life]

Yo.

Thanks for the breakdown, I'll go check it out tomorrow.


Ah, baseball.

At practice today, I was running in from SS to catch a short pop-up... It was going to land just behind the mound at Curt Flood. So I went into a slide (like at a base, feet-first) with my glove outstretched. The ball hit my glove but I didn't make the catch, and somehow in the process the ball went underneath me before my upper torso had hit the ground. So I landed hard on the ball and rolled on it a little bit.

So the cool part of the story is that it left a mark on my upper, middle back. You can literally see the seams of the ball on my back, even 10 hours later.

It fucking hurt though!

[Southpaw Slim]

Scott, as you know, I've always been interested in playing at Franklin ever since Sarah lived there. However, with the addition of lefty power hitters, it's becoming less of an option in my eyes. I do love the short porch in LC, though. I would love the opportunity to rob some home runs. I know you would, too. I think if we hit a snag, it should be our 4th field (after Raimondi). What does everyone think about this?

PS: It would be VERY easy for Will, Carlos or Ahmer to hit homers out of this field. The fence is as tall as Curt Flood in RF, and closer to the plate. I think we might need an extra fielder past the fence to collect HR balls. And, the short porch in LC will make for some interesting would-be-double HRs.

[tallguy]

Ant, I think you meant Pat and Dave drive luxury cars. I drive a Honda Civic, dude.
I think Franklin looks interesting, probably we would have the same issue with lefties hitting all the HR, but I think we should try it one time, instead of a Defremery session, perhaps.
To solve my problem of not being able to hit it out at Curt Flood, I am going to work on switch hitting...

[Pat K]

I have not seen this field, but it does sound intereting. Do not worry about me and Sally(my 94' 325is). If the place is REALLY ghetto I can just drive my fiancee's car.

[tallguy]

I see two fields next to each other on the satellite photo. One is basically a square and has a softball field in the diagonally opposite corner from the baseball infield. The other is basically a quarter segment of a circle, with home plate at the center of the circle, so the distance to the fence is the same all the way around the perimeter. That is a really nice feature, in my mind. The first one is thus like Defremery in shape, but with the softball infield added, with the second one being like Raimondi in shape.
Which one would/could we use? I like the look of either one.

[AntMoOAK]

Hey all... I just came from Franklin (the gates are open)... lefties have a very distinct vantage even with the tall fence. I see very few homers down the line in LF... kind of far and they extended the height of the fence. So most of the homers would be the straight to center challenge and getting it over that fence. The infield is about the same size as DeFremery. RF is shorter than I thought... basically the same as DeFremery with twice the height of the fence.

McConnell... The baseball field is the one the lower part of the screen with the grass infield and that's the one most used by baseball players. McConnell's ghetto... but I ain't scurred... Paul... I could've sworn you pulled up in a 7 series Beemer at the batting cages in Pinole. anywhoo... choics abound